OLIVER PETERSON: But I want to bring in the Federal Resources Minister, Madeleine King first. Good to have you on the programme. Good afternoon.

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: Yeah, good afternoon, Ollie. How are you going?

OLIVER PETERSON: I'm all right. I just see this mish-mashing of, you know, state and federal issues in the lead-up to twin elections in 2025. The gloves are off. It's on.

KING: Well, I mean, nothing like a bit of a political rah-rah before we go into Christmas time. But I mean it's important. Elections are important. We've seen most of the democratic world has had elections this year. So, I guess we're lucky to skate out of 2024 without our state election or federal election. But you know, that's democracy and I embrace it and I hope everyone else does too and I. But I do know it gets frustrating.

PETERSON: Would you, would you like to go first as the federal election, then the state election next year Minister?

KING: Look, I really don't mind. I think I know we've got a good story to tell. We've been working hard for Western Australians and all Australians on so many things addressing the cost of living, pressures people are feeling, but equally getting things done. Like in my portfolio for instance, you know, getting a critical minerals and rare earth industry off the ground which is going to future-proof our economy. So, I'm proud of that. I'm proud of the work our government does and I'm really happy with how the state government is doing and what they're doing for the people of Western Australia. So, you know, I'm ready anytime Ollie, to be honest, and I'll go however we need to go.

PETERSON: Do you think it's more of a combined ticket these days? Do you think that your brand is Labour? Whether it is under Roger Cook's leadership or Anthony Albanese's leadership in the state and the federal teams united together. Taking on the Liberal Party, whether it's Peter Dutton or Libby Metham's ranks, is a stronger way to go almost on a united ticket, on a united front. Labor versus Liberal.

KING: Oh well, generally we are united. We share the same values. But it's important to remember that there are always are a few differences between state and federal governments and that's not always a bad thing. The main thing is that we work together really productively and in the both the state's interest in the national interest.

I mean, you know this and your listeners know this. When WA does well, the whole country does well. So, that's, you know, always in the front of my mind when I'm thinking about federal issues. You know, there are some things that don't apply in WA but you know, they're still in the resources sector and part of that work that I do. But by and large, we know the backbone of our economy being the Pilbara, the Pilbara iron ore, and the gas out of Dampier, you know, if that goes really well, the rest of the country goes really well. So, I know that Roger Cook knows that, Anthony Albanese knows that and that's why, you know, we do work together so closely. Shared values and a shared understanding of the importance of the West.

PETERSON: Rio, BHP Woodside coming together for this announcement that you're looking at this iron making electric smelting furnace, you want to place it in Kwinana. What's this all about, Minister?

KING: Oh, look, this is a really amazing project and you know, most people wouldn't expect these four iconic companies to come together in such a fashion, but they are and they did that this morning down at Kwinana or East Rockingham, depending on which electorate you're in at the moment. But the NeoSmelt concept is about making the most used metal in the world, which is iron turning into steel, become decarbonised. You know, we build cities with steel, we build cars, you know, all sorts of things. Everything's got steel in it to some degree. So, if we can decarbonise that process and make it more energy efficient and less dependent on the smelting with coal, we can do that for our Pilbara iron ore. And Pilbara iron ore is the, you know, holds the economy together through, you know, what it goes into. So, that's what NeoSmelt is about. And it's no accident that you bring together the two biggest iron ore producers in Rio Tinto and bhp, our biggest steel manufacturer in Bluescope and our biggest energy provider in Woodside are all coming together because they can see the opportunity this will bring. And, you know, this is the resources sector doing the heavy lifting in reducing emissions and they should be congratulated for it. All the thousands and thousands of people that work for the resources sector should be super proud of what they're doing to address climate change and to seek to reach net zero by 2050.

PETERSON: So, it's a pilot plant. Why Kwinana, not the Pilbara Minister?

KING: Well, Kwinana, it is a pilot plant. So, it's smaller, it does need more intensive work around it in terms of the research and the testing. But, you know, Kwinana has got everything, Ollie, you would know. It's got access to land, it's got the availability of energy and that's part of the Woodside project. And this is using Woodside gas to start the smelt process. It has all the companies nearby in Perth and therefore their workers. And it is just a test. It's a testing pilot facility with the idea that if you get it right here, where you can have the research being done close by to the universities and so forth and the scientists and the head offices of these companies, you get it right. In Kwinana you can get it right, right around the country. And that's a revolution. It's nothing short of a revolution in how you build cities. And, you know, it's so exciting. It's going to be a real pathway forward for our country and it's going to be coming out of Kwinana.

PETERSON: The iron ore though, has got to go from the Pilbara to Kwinana and then somehow leave Australia, say to whoever's buying it, maybe in China, for example. Is that adding an extra layer of cost?

KING: Well, I mean, remember this is a pilot plant. So, most of the iron ore, you know, by far the majority will still continue to go out in that most efficient of ports of Port Hedland. 3% of the GDP of the country goes out of that Port. So, that continues. This just brings down sort of a low volume to get the process right, the experimental kind of volume, so to speak. They build that up to scale and it goes out of bulk handling in Kwinana, which, you know, some, some iron ore does go out of there at the moment from some of the fields that are closer to Perth. There's not much of that. So, we do have access to iron ore bulk handling here. But remember, this is a pilot study, but a really important one. It's right on the, the edge of the possibilities of how we make steel. And I mean, I think the companies are pretty conservative about what stage they're at, but I'm, as you can probably tell, really enthusiastic to help them out because if we get this right, we change the world and we should be really excited about that as a community that in little East Rockingham and Kwinana is where it's going to happen.

PETERSON: No one else is doing anything similar around the world at the moment. There's not a similar neo smelt or somebody else trying to do what we're about to try and do. And hopefully it comes online in what, the next four to five years.

KING: Look, there's a lot of people trying to do a lot of things in decarbonising their processing. So, I'm sure that this is. People are looking at this right around the world. But the important thing is we have the biggest iron ore producers in the world looking at it and they're looking at it here and that's Rio and BHP. So, you know, we want to encourage them to build that process in the best place to build it, which is here in Kwinana. You might have a plant if it comes off up in Port Hedland, but also in Port Kembla on the east coast. And that's an important part of the community there in New South Wales.

PETERSON: I want to come back to those federal state issues, Madeleine King, because here's a bit of what Peter Dutton was asked today. Obviously the Opposition Leader, when it comes to your government managing the economy:

Dutton: Reserve Bank Governor has pointed out very clearly to the Treasurer that if you continue the reckless spending, inflation is going to stay higher for longer, which means interest rates stay higher for longer. And Australian families who have had 12 interest rate increases under this government don't see any relief in sight. Interest rates have already started to come down in Canada, in the United States, in New Zealand and in in the uk. Now they should have already come down here, but they haven't because as the Reserve Bank Governor points out, the government continues to spend. And as we're seeing in Victoria, the Labor Party there is destroying the local economy and it's exactly what Anthony Albanese and Jim Chalmers are doing at the federal level as well.

PETERSON: It would appear there that the economy stupid is going to be the opposition's election pitch at the moment. Is that what you're gearing up for, Minister?

KING: Well, the economy is so important. We know people are under a lot of pressure and you know, we've ensured we have managed the budget properly and we've had consecutive surpluses. We are investing in the right areas and not investing recklessly. I mean, Peter Dutton was part of a government that put commuter car parks nowhere near train stations. They put the inland rail on the east coast, which not many people know about. Here it's 600% over budget. I mean, they spent like crazy and then they spent really badly and managed it really poorly.

But you know, when Peter Dutton talks about the cost to the budget, I mean, what is he, what does he want to cut? I mean pensioners and anyone who gets a payment from government because they need it. You know, these things are indexed and that cost. So, if he's saying we should reduce the payments to pensioners, well, I guess he can say that if he wants. But I don't think that's a clever thing to do and I don't think it's a fair thing to do for our senior citizens and people on pension payments.

PETERSON: Are we spending beyond our means though? Because I know the Treasury is going to provide that economic update this week. We're not going to be in surplus anymore. Does that dent your re election chances, Minister?

KING: Look, I think it won't get into our re-election chances because we're just super focused on the community and what help they need to get them through what has been a difficult period. The long tail of COVID and I mean the economic tail continues to have its ups and downs and lots of countries around the world are seeing it and you know, it's fair to say that's getting better and that's a good thing. We've seen inflation reduce dramatically in this country. Used to have a six in front of it, now it has a two. So, it's going in the right direction. We keep working hard. The decisions our government makes around spending are prudent and thoughtful. They're applied in the right places and that's what we should all be focused on, but particularly focused on helping people see through these tough times. And that's what I'm really trying to do as well.

PETERSON: How do you think the nuclear announcements are going down?

KING: Oh, well, I think it's just absurd. I mean, I can't think of a more unreasonable thing to do when we do have these pressures on our budgets like a wholly outrageously costed proposal to build nuclear power plants around the country that are going to be owned by government, built by government. 

So, there's no private enterprise in this. There's no sharing of the risk with the private companies like Neo Smelt today. These are the resources companies of our country, you know, working to lower emissions off their own back. They're doing that because they know it's the best thing to do. It's in their interest, it's in the country's interest, it's in their customs interests. Building a nuclear power plant or eight of them for, you know, hundreds of billions of dollars and their costing. Did you know, Ollie, don't even include Western Australia. Like that's how serious they're taking it, that they're excluding Western Australia, the powerhouse of the nation is not included in Peter Dutton's costings on nuclear. I mean, it's an absolute joke and he's taking Western Australians for fools. I mean, I get really quite worked up about this because it's, it's disgraceful. Right. And you can see why the Premier's, you know, pretty annoyed about this because Peter Dutton doesn't want to, you know, include WA in his costings on nuclear plans. You can see he's coming for the GST. Like you just, you can see that, like joining the dots on a kid's puzzle.

PETERSON: It's, it's, that's a bit of scare mongering though, isn't the GST? Every single Polly that comes to WA, whether they be Labor, Liberal, One Nation, Green, the left, right out party, everybody commits to saying that they'll keep the GST fix in place. Surely we're not going to have a federal election fought over the GST share in WA again, are we?

KING: Well, I mean, I don't think we should either. But the thing is, you've got to ask yourself, what is Peter Dutton going to cut to pay for his nuclear power plants? What is he going to cut? He's probably going to take a slice of the GST. He's already said he doesn't back the production tax credit scheme for critical minerals. So, he's going to cut that and that, that's building a new industry in this country and in making us have a national sovereign capability in processing rare earths. And he's going to cut that. You'll probably cut my Geoscience Australia work, which is about exploring for new metals and new, you know, minerals for the future of our country and the world. But I absolutely think that if he wants to fund eight nuclear power plants around this country to be built by government, owned by government, he will definitely take a slice of our GST. What else is there to take?

PETERSON: Madeleine King, thanks for your time.

KING: Thanks, Ollie. Good to chat.