GARY ADSHEAD: All right. Now to more serious matters. I mean there's nothing better than winning money, but to more serious matters; WA's nickel mining and processing industry is hanging by a thread with BHP announcing already that its nickel concentrating plant in Kambalda will go into care and maintenance from June. Now the fear is that that's just the start, and that more than 3,000 jobs across the state are currently on the line. Yesterday, Premier Roger Cook told me his Government is considering how it might offer BHP some help. Have a listen. 

[Excerpt]

ROGER COOK: We're witnessing a significant restructure of the industry as a whole. I don't want to sugar‑coat this, this is going to be a tough period for the nickel industry. We are working closely with the Federal Government; I speak of Madeleine King, the Resources Minister, on almost a daily basis. 

GARY ADSHEAD: Is there any thought about needing to subsidise them at the moment? 

ROGER COOK: Well, look, in the context of a lot of our miners, clearly royalties and royalty relief is where we can do the heavy lifting, but when it comes to big down‑stream processing players such as smelters and refineries, that's beyond our pay scale, and we really need other levels of government to become involved. 

[End of Excerpt]

GARY ADSHEAD: All right. Other levels of government. Well, the Federal Resources Minister, Madeleine King, joins me on the line. Thanks very much for your time, Minister. 

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: My pleasure to be here, Gary. 

GARY ADSHEAD: I'll cut to the chase. Will you and the State Government help provide that royalty relief? 

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: Well, as the Premier said yesterday, we do talk regularly on this matter and many others, but this has obviously been a very serious development just yesterday from BHP that we have known since late December, operations at different nickel facilities have been affected by the extraordinary glut of supply of nickel in international markets. So they're reacting to that quite naturally in the way commerce does, but you know, the flow‑on effect of that is jobs for Western Australians in a nickel industry that's been around for 50 years. So I'm very keenly aware of, you know, who loses in the end is the working people that, you know, might not be able to go to their ‑ the work they have in Kalgoorlie or Kambalda or the mines, but also very importantly the Nickel West refinery in my electorate of Brand in Rockingham. So I feel it keenly, and we're working together with the state on what we can do. 

GARY ADSHEAD: Have they asked for royalty relief? 

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: Have the ‑‑ 

GARY ADSHEAD: [Indistinct] or ‑‑

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: Yeah, we've had round tables, and Minister Michael was there, the Minister for Mines and myself and industry representatives, Industry itself, and worker representatives as well made helpful contributions. The nickel industry is looking for widespread assistance. It's fair to say royalty relief is one part of the puzzle, but as the Premier said ‑‑ 

GARY ADSHEAD: Well, then, I will ask the question. What are you waiting for? 

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: Well, I mean this is ‑ well, as the Premier said, the royalty relief does sit within the remit of State Government, and ‑‑ 

GARY ADSHEAD: Yeah. 

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: ‑‑ and I know the Premier's looking at that. What I am doing as the Federal Resources Minister is working with the Prime Minister and the Treasurer around other means that the Federal Government, what we can bring to the table, and what I am bringing to the table today is moving nickel from the Strategic Materials List on to the Critical Minerals List. So that will be announced more formally later today, but I'm letting you know that. 

GARY ADSHEAD: Okay. 

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: And what that does is enable the nickel industry to access the $4 billion Critical Minerals Facility. So, look, I know that's not the whole answer; I do accept that. But it's an important step while we work out how we build this bridge which the industry has to build with levels of government, as the Premier's rightly said, to get us to the point where that nickel surplus depletes, where prices go back to more normal, 'cause we're facing some extraordinary international market forces here, that things are beyond our control, but that we have to be cognisant of them and do whatever we can with Industry in the face of those forces. 

GARY ADSHEAD: All right. So you're talking with the Premier, or the Premier said he's talking with you on a daily basis. Is there any suggestion that that royalty relief that they asked for, whether it might have been December or January, is going to be granted at this point; do you know, and do we know that? 

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: Look, I mean, I'm not going to, you know, step in and make decisions for the State Government, that's not the right thing to do, but I know they're very actively considering, it's an important ‑‑ 

GARY ADSHEAD: Okay. 

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: ‑‑ part of the puzzle, but as the Premier has said, and I think everyone knows, that can't ‑ that won't alone shift the dial as far as it needs to shift. So I accept that the Federal Government has to join in on this. We've taken a significant step ‑ I've taken a significant step this morning, but we will work on more. 

GARY ADSHEAD: Because if I'm not mistaken, I mean the industry itself through their Chamber were asking for nickel to be put on the Critical Minerals List, that was last year, wasn't it, and I think they were very disappointed that it didn't happen. So have you blown an opportunity there, that you're now sort of playing catch‑up on? 

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: Well, and I do accept those submissions, and nickel industry, and there's another few minerals that are on the Strategic Materials List that also wanted to be on the Critical Minerals List, and the problem that I face as Resources Minister is that where everything's a priority, nothing's a priority. 

So we do have to be careful ‑‑ 

GARY ADSHEAD: Well, it's a priority when 3,000 jobs ‑‑ 

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: ‑‑ but we've ‑‑ 

GARY ADSHEAD: But it's a priority ‑ obviously it's a priority ‑‑ 

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: Look, yeah, I know ‑‑ 

GARY ADSHEAD: But it's priority back then for them.  Now that we've got to a point where we could lose 3,000 jobs in WA, it becomes a ‑ well, it becomes a matter of urgency, doesn't it? 

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: Yeah, and that's why I've put it on the Critical Minerals List today. So you're absolutely right. But we weren't in the same situation in December that we are in now, or even just a month ago. And also, like we think of critical minerals as what's in shortage as well, or where supply chains can be damaged, and right now you can get nickel really easily, right, there's a lot of it, there's 200,000 tonnes surplus around the world. So it doesn't fit into the ordinary decision‑making criteria that you'd expect for critical minerals. So we've had to take the step and make sure we use my discretion, that I made sure I had as Resources Minister when I updated how the Critical Minerals List would be formulated, so on any given day I can work with how that list can change, and that's what I've done. But I don't want anyone to think that I think this is the magic carpet that gets us there. Like there does need to be more done, and we need to work with Industry to make that happen, because you're absolutely right, Gary, there are a lot of jobs at risk here, and there's a sovereign capacity problem here as well.  Like the Nickel West Refinery that I've driven past literally all my life on the way to Fremantle, or, when I go to Kwinana later today I'll drive past it again, it's the only one in the country, right, and it's precious, so ‑ and BHP have lost money on that facility for a long time, they've invested a lot of money in it, and I'm appreciative of what they've done, and I'm appreciative of discussions that I've had with BHP in relation to it. So we will ‑‑ 

GARY ADSHEAD: Have they said to you, out of interest, BHP, I mean they're a big player, I mean they're a multi‑billion dollar corporation. I mean I'm not ‑ you know, we can't ‑‑ 

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: They sure are. 

GARY ADSHEAD: I'm not sure that many taxpayers would say, "Oh, yeah, spend whatever you need as a Federal Government to help bail them out of this situation." I don't think that's the case. But have they said to you what could save the jobs or has the boat sailed now in terms of the nickel market right now as far as BHP's concerned? Is it just too late? 

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: I mean ‑ yeah, yeah, the boat certainly hasn't sailed, you know, it's not in care and maintenance, it's not going to that, they've admitted today that ‑ yesterday, sorry ‑ that they've devalued the facility and they're going to start looking at that. That's a lengthy process BHP has to go through, and there were many considerations. So that hasn't yet happened. I want to prevent it happening. So we've got time, but not much time to work on that, and we'll face it with urgency. And BHP is a gargantuan business, we know that, and they make a lot of money off iron ore and coal on the East Coast; equally they employ many, many thousands of Australians that also, you know, pay into our tax system, and so it's a job‑creating company, BHP, and I respect the work they've done. So for your listeners that know the magnitude of BHP, you know, the Australian Government can't throw, you know, millions or billions or just grant money cash to save these things, but we have other things we need to look at, how we can have low‑interest de‑ risking loans available like the Critical Minerals Facility, which would now be available if they were able to work on the Kalgoorlie Smelter upgrades, or whatever else they might have planned. 

GARY ADSHEAD: All right. 

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: So that's available, but you know, the taxpayer, you know, clearly needs to have some reassurance that whatever money you give to someone like BHP, you're going to get it back, right. So I'm keen to be very clear with Industry as well. Like we can't ‑ we can't cash grant them out of this problem. They know that too though; we've all been very upfront with this, I think. 

GARY ADSHEAD: Minister, can I just ask finally though, obviously, you know, the strange thing here is that we talk about energy transition, we talk about going to battery storage, and so on, and nickel at this stage of the game is an imperative. But if BHP fail with nickel, then that industry that you're trying to build and create is also in trouble, isn't it? 

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: You've hit the nail on the head, Gary, it is a very big problem. This is something we're clearly aware of and working on. Nickel is a very important cog in the wheel of renewable energy technologies and battery storage, and that's why we're working hard to make sure we can, you know, build that bridge to when the market recovers ‑‑ 

GARY ADSHEAD: 'Cause it would be ridiculous if we have to import nickel into Australia in order to prop up our battery storage and transition plans, wouldn't it? 

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: Yeah, I would agree with that statement, yes. And I don't want that to happen, so that's why we're working hard to make sure it doesn't, but that we ‑ you know, it's extraordinary the changes seen in this market in five years, you know, we've gone from our near neighbour in Indonesia having virtually none of the market internationally to nearly 52 per cent, I think it is, so in five years. So, you know, this is ‑ it's extraordinary, and how you can compete with that is, you know, also a very difficult proposition, and that's what BHP and others have been up against, and you know, I accept that the State and Federal Governments have to do what they can to build that bridge, and that includes in international markets, you know, putting a high value on the nickel we produce in Western Australia, because it is for higher worker standards, there are higher environmental standards. These factories in Indonesia, and you know, they employ a lot of people and provide for the wellbeing of many Indonesians, which is a good thing, but equally 21 people died in an accident in January in one of those refineries. Now that's not what happened here, and worker safety is a premium concern of our industry, and we want to make sure that we mains the case, and same with worker conditions. That supports our lifestyle, right, so we're not competing on an even playing field here when it comes to nickel. 

GARY ADSHEAD: Understood. 

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: So internationally on markets that's the other body of work I'm doing as well, but that will take longer. 

GARY ADSHEAD: Minister, we've got to leave it there. I really appreciate you coming on and explaining the situation as we see it at the moment. I'm sure there will be some developments in the next couple of days. Thanks very much for that. 

MINISTER MADELEINE KING: Thanks a lot.